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Average Rating: 5
Number of people who have voted: 1


By the same author as Grand Line 3.5
Comments:

Rudedog

Rudedog




16th Jan 2019, 1:55 AM

Not a lot more frustrating than an opponent that you literally have no chance of harming. All you can do is flee and retry after you've opened your wallet for the necessary silver bullets!

Anyone want to tell a tale about an opponent you needed special measures to defeat?

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SeriousBiz




16th Jan 2019, 4:38 AM

One I remember fondly was a guardian golem with a special outer shell that made it immune to not only magic damage, but slashing, piercing and bludgeoning damage as well. We were understandably at a loss at first and retreated, but we were also on a pretty tight time schedule and couldn't really go out to level up (and the DM even assured us outright that the golem did not actually have too high a challenge rating for our level 8 party, and that this was just another puzzle for us to solve). Instead, we decided to explore the rest of the dungeon in hopes of finding clues as to how to defeat it. Thankfully, we eventually figured out its weakness from tomes left behind by its creator: while the coating itself didn't vibrate at all from impact (magical countermeasure to minimize the outer layer's weakness, insert long pseudo-scientific magic babble about extradimensional gaps here), it was highly sensitive to vibrations of most kinds applied directly to it.

Neither our wizard nor our cleric had prepared the Shatter spell (which might have been somewhat useful in hindsight), but we figured that non-magical vibrations, if not as effective, would probably work as well. Since our weaponry and equipment were pretty standard, involving no complex apparatus that could have helped, we threw all caution to the wind, jumped at the golem from all sides and started making touch attacks on it, explained in-game as making vibrating movements on its shell with our fingers alone. Wouldn't you know it, the shell started quickly falling apart where the vibration was applied.

Though we had to suffer a few attacks of opportunity, we were eventually able to free the standard flesh golem hiding underneath the protective layer and then fight it on an equal level. In other words, we tickled away the magic coating.

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Mr. Guy




16th Jan 2019, 8:24 AM

Too many to count. That was the standard MO of an old GM when it came to bosses. Not just the final end boss, but the top enemy of every arc. We would get introduced to the enemy, get our asses kicked, then have to go find the MacGuffin that would allow us to actually harm them. It got annoying very quickly.

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Poker




17th Jan 2019, 9:25 AM

the get defeated on first try then come back stronger/with the propper way to fight back later is something i can really enjoy once or twice, but every boss is way too much.

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Heyoceama




17th Jan 2019, 1:35 PM

At that point I'd start double tapping and maybe burning bodies.

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Guest




16th Jan 2019, 12:41 PM

CoC where we’re fighting some immortal bastard. He’s really strong and fast, plus every time he dies he gets back up fully healed. Even if we disabled him he’d just have some contingency to kill himself and get back up. The DM planned on us to go on a quest through Eldritch tomes and magical items to find something to send this guy to his final rest.

We encased him in a big block of concrete and dumped him into the Mariana Trench. Made him the Deep Ones problem

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*Sigh*




16th Jan 2019, 2:47 AM

I do find it kind of interesting in retrospect that Smoker wasn't impeded at all by the rain, out of all of the Logia fruits Crocodile's, Ace's, and by extension Smoker's I think would make the most sense as being affected by rain or similar phenomena, as smoke is so inherently connected to fire and we all know fire's connection to water.

I have a feeling that if this fight was redone in the modern day Oda would have taken it into account, or at the very least justified why it didn't do anything instead of not bringing it up at all.

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Guest




16th Jan 2019, 3:28 AM

Honestly I think smoke's weakness is heavy wind. Makes it hard to maintain cohesion.

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Crisis




16th Jan 2019, 4:40 AM

Smoke may be connected to fire, but it just plain isn't fire and therefore would have different weaknesses.

I agree with the guest that high winds make more sense as a weakness than rain or water in general.

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Guest




16th Jan 2019, 9:56 AM

well, smoke in the general sense is connected to fire, but Smoker's power are not as far as we know. the DF just skip the fire part of "when there's smoke there's fire".

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Departure_Dave




16th Jan 2019, 5:21 PM

I the Crocodile fight had the excuse of the blood being salty water and therefore sea-water adjacent? I could be misremembering things though.

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Guest




16th Jan 2019, 6:28 PM

As far as I know, blood contains enough water that splashing blood on Crocodile should probably be enough to activate his DF’s special weakness to water.

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Isaiahomega




24th Jan 2019, 4:05 PM
"Late reply"

Crocodile's specific water weakness doesn't really have anything to do with sea water in particular. It's because while if you stick your hand in dry sand the sand will flow over itself and won't really impede your hand much, wet sand can't really move one itself and is more solid as a result, which meant Luffy could actually make an impact on Crocodile's body.

Tl;dr sandcastles need to meet wet but it doesn't matter how.

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Phantomdemon




16th Jan 2019, 4:58 AM
"Broken from the word go."

So, can't be harmed except by magic weapons, and even those have a 50% at failing.

While also being immune to magic below a certain level.

How the hell is this playable then? That seems more like a monster character or the big bad of a 1-10 campaign then it does a Player Character.

Without some serious Flaws to get something like that, I really don't get how anyone would allow that to be ok. I'm pretty chill as a DM, and I'd say no to that in a heartbeat.

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Arillius




16th Jan 2019, 7:06 AM

What you don't realize is that the magic that can bypass it is actually fairly common outside this low level starting adventure. Almost every person past a certain point in the story is capable of it, making it almost useless. It's a neat ability now that comes with some heavy weaknesses (and usually Logia have an additional weakness ontop of sea water and the sea stones) but is definitely not game breaking.

I've also toyed with entirely invulnerable characters in the past for some stories. With enough down side, it can be fun to have a character that can only bear witness to things. Especially if you make him too thick headed to be a good scout.

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Deez Rodenutz




18th Jan 2019, 5:05 PM

Marvel Comics has "Butterball", a hero who is totally immune to all physical damage, and highly resistant to mental attacks (though mind control is possible).

The downside to it is that when these powers kicked in he was a low intelligence, slow, weak, overweight fry cook.

So now even though he has crazy immunity, he has none of the skills or physique of a superhero, and his powers prevent exercise and training from ever have any effect.
He can't even get intimate since, again, he is immune to ALL physical effects.

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Guest




16th Jan 2019, 9:59 AM

Yeah, it's a bit like Arillius said. Logia re OP at early levels, but get outmatched later on. A well used paramecia can actually prove more versatile, too.

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Paranoidpequin




16th Jan 2019, 10:53 AM

Sure. They’re powerful now but they come with heafty weaknesses as well. A dunk in the ocean ( in a High seas campaign) is lethal, if someone has a certain kind of weapon ( sea stone) not only is he Vunrable to it but it’s ridiculously easy to hit him as his form gives him a bigger surface area and thus a shit AC.As well there’s either a feat or class ability (Haki) that is essentially the same as sea stone but can be applied to anything and everything. And finally all Logia have a secondary weakness that can be exploited

Yes it can be invincible in certain cases but if given the right opponent ( like any good DM can provide) then they are just as if not more vulnerable then anyone else.

Also certain other devil fruits are far more broken then Logia. paramicia types can bring in a Save or die attack like Boa’s fruit, an almost impossible to dodge or counter ability like Law’s ,and don’t even get me started on the Luck Fruit and the Pet fruits brokenness

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Phantomdemon




16th Jan 2019, 12:22 PM

Like, I'm aware that at higher levels it wouldn't be as broken, but that's why I mentioned it as being more a boss for a 1-10 campaign.

As it is, without having Smoker's direct counter, and since his ability allows for him to partially fly, he's practically unbeatable until we hit the Grandline, and even then he's still pretty OP.

I can't say how abundant Seastone is as a resource for the Players, as that's DM ruling, and Haki seems like it's a higher level ability, or maybe something akin to a Cleric's level 10 ability to call on their god, mixed with Monk's Ki for things like Armament.

It just bugs me, since as it is, Smoker seems leagues ahead of everyone else in terms of power. It's like seeing a level 10 player walking around with level 5 players.

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DeadpanSal




17th Jan 2019, 3:03 AM

Yeah, but that's kind of the point. You can't kick every cop in the face and expect the DM to keep sending stuff exactly your level your way just because it wouldn't be sporting for local law enforcement to take you seriously.

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Phantomdemon




17th Jan 2019, 1:34 PM

I would have no problem with that, if the cop in question wasn't a fellow Player Character.

That's really the big issue I have with this. As it stands, Smoker is leagues ahead of everyone in terms of power as he simply can't get hit for the most part.

Like, Nami and Ussop aren't weak, not particularly strong mind you, but not weak. They're more normal characters, while Zoro and Luffy are explicit combat/melee builds and they make up for it with the mass amounts of Flaws they have. They're balanced, not so much in combat, but in skills as a whole.

Maybe if it was mentioned that to get this stuff that Smoker had to take a huge number of Flaws or something, but as it stands, it doesn't seem like he has as many flaws as Zoro, yet is still stronger then Zoro.

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Halosty45

Halosty45




16th Jan 2019, 12:21 PM

It's playable because it's the kind of game that allows you to get huge damage reduction at first level. When nothing is balanced, everything is balanced. Or not.

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Guest




16th Jan 2019, 8:00 PM

Well if I was smokers PC and or DM I would take into account that he literally carries around his own weakness. Luffy would literally be able to win if the point of that fight was for him to actually win just by doing something he is already known to do in this comic and that is disarm smoker of his seastone tipped jutte and then attack him with that.

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DragonTrainer

DragonTrainer




16th Jan 2019, 10:51 PM

Fun fact, in the Boss Luffy Historical Special, Luffy uses a jitte. :p

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